In a world that pulls us in countless directions, mastering the art of staying present and crafting messages that resonate is more crucial than ever.
In this episode of Talking About Marketing, Steve Davis and David Olney take us on a journey through mindfulness, the art of leadership, crafting compelling marketing messages, and the enduring power of classic political campaign strategies.
The Person segment delves into the importance of mindfulness and staying present in our fast-paced world.
In Principles, they explore the significance of leadership that empowers others, drawing parallels from politics to small business.
The Problems segment focuses on how to craft marketing messages that truly resonate with your audience.
Finally, in Perspicacity, they reflect on the timeless appeal of the "It's Time" campaign, pondering its relevance in today's political landscape.
Get ready to take notes!
Talking About Marketing podcast episode notes with timecodes
01:20 Person This segment focusses on you, the person, because we believe business is personal.
Mindful Mastery: Taming the Mental Chaos in Business
In the Person segment of this episode, Steve and David dive into the importance of mindfulness, particularly for small business owners who often find themselves overwhelmed by the demands of their roles. Steve shares his personal experience with the Sam Harris mindfulness app, noting how daily mindfulness exercises help him manage the constant stream of thoughts that can often feel like being in the middle of a busy Grand Central Station.
The discussion highlights how mindfulness practices, such as focusing on the present moment, can help individuals manage the internal noise and distractions that arise during a typical day. David adds that through practices like yoga and playing guitar, he’s been able to create a sense of space and calmness, even in the midst of mental chaos. They both agree that being aware of one’s thoughts, without getting lost in them, is a powerful tool not just for personal well-being but also for professional effectiveness.
This segment serves as a reminder that mindfulness isn't just about relaxation; it's about recognizing and managing the flood of thoughts that can derail our focus and productivity. By learning to observe these thoughts without becoming consumed by them, small business owners can maintain clarity and effectiveness in their daily lives, leading to better decision-making and less stress.
It also features some thoughts by professor of psychology at the University of Miami, Dr. Amishi Jha, PhD, from her chat with Sam Harris in an episode of Making Sense, titled, The Roots of Attention.
13:20 Principles This segment focusses principles you can apply in your business today.
Principled Leadership: The Art of Following to Lead Effectively
In the Principles segment, Steve and David explore the concept of leadership through the lens of current political events and small business management. Steve reflects on the disappointment many felt after Joe Biden’s lackluster performance in a public debate against Donald Trump, and the subsequent relief when Kamala Harris was proposed as a more credible candidate. This political drama provides a backdrop for a deeper discussion on the qualities that make a leader truly effective.
David introduces the idea that great leaders aren’t necessarily those who dominate or demand control, but those who empower others to succeed. Drawing inspiration from the pairing of Kamala Harris with Tim Walz, David emphasises the importance of valuing and trusting your team. He explains that many small business founders struggle with this, often trying to do everything themselves or demanding that tasks be done exactly their way. However, by recognising and leveraging the strengths of their team members, founders can reduce stress, improve outcomes, and foster a more positive work environment.
The discussion highlights the military concept of “mission orders,” where a leader outlines the desired outcome and then trusts their team to figure out the best way to achieve it. This approach not only empowers the team but also allows the leader to focus on the bigger picture. Steve and David stress that effective leadership in small business is not about micromanaging but about clearing the path for others to do their best work. Through collaboration and trust, leaders can create a thriving environment where both the business and its people can flourish.
25:20 Problems This segment answers questions we've received from clients or listeners.
Crafting Messages That Resonate: Avoiding the Pitfalls of Generic Communication
In this week’s Problems segment, Steve and David delve into the recurring issue of ineffective messaging in marketing, drawing on insights from Alan Dibb’s Lean Marketing. Steve emphasises the importance of crafting a message that truly resonates with the intended audience, highlighting that many communication failures occur because businesses fail to focus on the customer rather than themselves.
David adds that some of the worst marketing content he’s encountered comes from those who unintentionally write for themselves, believing they’re writing for their clients. This self-centered approach often results in messaging that fails to connect with the target audience, leading to missed opportunities and ineffective campaigns.
The discussion then pivots to a real-world example involving a driving instructor seeking marketing help. The instructor wanted his Facebook advertising to stand out, which Steve and David commend. However, they stress that while being different is crucial, it’s even more important that the difference resonates with the intended audience. They conclude that effective messaging should be direct, relatable, and include a clear call to action. By avoiding generic language and focusing on what truly matters to the audience, businesses can transform interest into attention and ultimately, success.
28:30 Perspicacity This segment is designed to sharpen our thinking by reflecting on a case study from the past.
Reviving Classic Campaigns: Could 'It's Time' Work Today?
In this week’s Perspicacity segment, Steve and David explore the timeless nature of one of Australia's most iconic political campaign songs, "It's Time," which played a significant role in Gough Whitlam's rise to power in the 1970s. The discussion begins with a nostalgic look at the ad and the powerful emotions it evoked, noting that the sentiment of "It's Time" could still resonate today, albeit with a modern remix to update its 1970s sound.
David Olney highlights the strength of the message "It's Time," comparing it to other political slogans like Trump's "Make America Great Again." While both are vague enough to allow people to project their own meanings, "It's Time" carries a forward-looking momentum, whereas "Make America Great Again" implies a return to the past. This forward motion is what gives "It's Time" its enduring appeal, making it a campaign slogan that could be adapted for contemporary use.
Steve draws parallels between the mass appeal of "It's Time" and Kamala Harris's current political campaign in the U.S., noting how both have garnered significant support from celebrities and public figures. The segment concludes with a nod to another famous Australian political slogan, "Keep the Bastards Honest," used by the Australian Democrats in the 1990s. While effective in its time, it lacked the timeless quality of "It's Time," which the hosts agree could still inspire action today if appropriately updated.
Transcript This transcript was generated using Descript.
A Machine-Generated Transcript - Beware Errors
TAMP S05E02
[00:00:00] David Olney: Because an unhappy Elon is a happy world.
[00:00:09] Caitlin Davis: Talking about marketing is a podcast for business owners and leaders produced by my dad, Steve Davis, and his colleague at Talked About Marketing, David Olney, in which they explore marketing through the lens of their own four P's, person, principles, problems, and perspicacity. Yes, you heard that correctly.
Apart from their love of words, they really love helping people. So they hope this podcast will become a trusted companion on your journey in business.
[00:00:41] Steve Davis: David, I am about two weeks dry. You have done really well. No X has been marking a spot on my palm for that amount of time.
[00:00:53] David Olney: And your thumb is not permanently sore from tapping and liking.
[00:00:57] Steve Davis: Correct. Onwards we go. Time to be mindful.
[00:01:06] Caitlin Davis: Our four Ps. Number one, person. The aim of life is self development. To realise one's nature perfectly. That is what each of us is here for. Oscar Wilde.
[00:01:23] Steve Davis: In the person segment, we're going to a path of mindfulness, just briefly, because, and it's actually quite fitting that in the intro, I think you would have heard some sound of some birds tweeting out there, because I do the Sam Harris mindfulness app most mornings, uh, when I, when it's not the two mornings I'm at the gym, I'll go walking and do my 20 minutes mindfulness And it's often in a park, and often there are birds, and sometimes I'm paying attention to them, if that's what Sam wants us to do, and sometimes I'm not, I'm focusing on other things.
And, really, the core insight from this opening segment is drawing our attention to paying a little attention to our minds, because there's a lot going on in there. As Leonard Cohen once said, Because he was a great person. He was great for meditating. He said, When you still yourself and reflect on your mind, it's like you're standing in the middle of Grand Central Station in New York.
It is so busy and that's been my intuition as well. Is your, have you got a busy brain, David?
[00:02:37] David Olney: I've got a busy brain, but thanks to playing guitar and yoga, I can make the space around me in Grand Central Station quite big and quiet. David. I can push it all back a little bit, which I'm very grateful for.
[00:02:50] Steve Davis: Just play some bad chords on that guitar and people will give you a wide berth?
[00:02:54] David Olney: Well, normally they'll make more noise. You actually want to play soothing music, so they go, Ahhhh.
[00:03:00] Steve Davis: Then your world gets quieter. Well, in Sam's podcast, Making Sense, he just interviewed Dr. Amishi Jha. She's a professor of psychology at the University of Miami, and they get into a conversation, About trying to understand the different states the brain can be in.
And one of the states they talk about is the default state. Which is when it's not necessarily engaged in a task. It's in that supposedly neutral, uh, position. And what they've found is that neutral is probably the worst way to describe it. It's as busy as heck. Because it's got, oh, I've got time to play now.
I can do what I like. I'm not restricted to a task and part of the challenge that we feel is relevant for the person segment is trying to get a task done that must be done and everything inside you wants to like, like wild horses breaking out of the, uh, the gates, just wanting to be somewhere else, go somewhere else, drink from a pond, get a little hit of dopamine somewhere, and it takes a lot of resolve to bring the horses back, David.
[00:04:17] David Olney: It does. It's something so many people either get lost in reflecting on something that happened yesterday, or worrying about something that's going to happen tomorrow, and They are the easy thoughts to go to, because, well, there was always a yesterday, and you can always go, Oh, I didn't like how that was, or that could have been better.
And with tomorrow, there's always something where you want to perfect it, and try and make sure it turns out better. So our brain will really default to not necessarily doing something interesting, but doing something that maintains our attention, and raises sort of our emotional temperature. And yet mindfulness really is about just being able to be calm without having to be overstimulated or without having to have a flood of thoughts.
You know, some sort of hormone leading, leading to feeling wired.
[00:05:15] Steve Davis: Well, they do talk about this in the conversation as they get on to it. In fact, I have found it a little bit helpful in the last week or so since listening to it, of just acknowledging, becoming aware that there's this pull of Thought or thinking that's happening that's pulling attention in a certain direction and the job as Sam Continues to say often in mindfulness is not to then say hey stop that thought The battle is actually just noticing that it's there and noticing that it's an object of your attention and that is Is what can take away some of the imp some of its potency, make it a little impotent.
And again, he said, it's not to change the valence of the situation. You still might be feeling a little bit happy or a little bit sad, depending on the thought, but noticing it means you're not at one with it. You're not lost in it. Um, in fact, let's have a quick listen to a little snippet, and then we'll just try and tease this apart just a little bit more.
[00:06:18] Amishi Jha: What do you do to get there? So if we all have this mode. Why do we need to bother practicing mindfulness and mindfulness exercises or mindfulness practices? And what, what are the factors that deter us from holding that mental mode more often? And this gets into what I would sometimes refer to as sort of the dark matter of cognition, which are also known as distractibility or mind wandering, having off task thoughts during an ongoing task or activity.
And so one of the ways that I like to describe mindfulness is using this metaphor of an mp3 player. And thinking about our capacity, our intrinsic capacity for mental time travel, there's a lot of chatter happening, and we're filled with that chatter, and oftentimes that chatter takes us to the past so that we can reflect on it, or it takes us to the future so we can plan for it, but oftentimes, especially for the kinds of populations that my lab works with, under high stress circumstances, especially when those periods are protracted, you're rewinding and fast forwarding in very unproductive ways.
So that now, when you're rewinding, the chatter may be a lot of rumination, and you're kind of, that flashlight is yanked to the past and almost stuck there, or you are forecasting a doom filled, catastrophic scenario in the future, which you just made up in your mind, and in some sense, this is what we're kind of jockeying between, uh, rumination and catastrophizing, and so when we think about what mindfulness is, it's keeping the button on play.
So that you are actually experiencing the moment to moment unfolding of what is transpiring of your life, frankly. And so this also, I think, makes it very kind of accessible. Like, okay, I get that. I get that there's a need for me to do something because I can imagine the tendency of my mind. And we know what the, what the data says about 50 percent of our waking moments.
We're not here. We're in the past or the future, you know, and kind of rapidly going back and forth between those. So it will take some kind of exercise if I want more moments where I spontaneously end up. able to be in the mindful mode in the present moment with that button on play.
[00:08:25] Steve Davis: That's Dr. Amishi Jha with those thoughts, and I think you touched on it earlier, that divide of us reverting to either ruminating over something in the past or worrying about something. And interesting, there's something else in the podcast, the reason in Sam's meditation, daily meditation, sometimes he focuses on breathing, Sometimes it might be on how you're feeling when you're sitting.
Can you just feel the sense of where you're pressing against the back of the chair? Sometimes it's looking at what's around you, uh, listening, sounds, and sometimes thoughts themselves use the focus. He said he likes to keep moving it because if you're being attracted to do some mindfulness practice and you're feeling anxious and you focus, you choose the focus, your heartbeat, you're directing attention to yourself.
to something that's quite closely related to the source of feeling anxious in the first place, and it's just going to lend it to feeling worse because you're drawing all the attention where you kind of want to back that foot off the accelerator pedal.
[00:09:31] David Olney: Yeah, I think the big takeaway here is that we are always more than the thought or sensation that is the loudest.
So if we're worried about tomorrow, we're bigger than that. If we're fretting over yesterday, we're bigger than that. If our heart is racing and we feel our chest is tight from stress, we are more than that. And really the whole point of mindfulness is to go, whatever these things are, they're smaller than you.
And you can go, I notice that. But I'm not going there. That's not the only thing I can do. I can sit here and be comfortable being me, and I can think about, what did I learn from yesterday? What am I going to plan to do for tomorrow? So, part of mindfulness is the ability to, rather than be consumed by things that are smaller than us, is to reflect on, you know, yesterday, plan for tomorrow, but in a way, we're big us.
is in control of the small thing, and is making the small thing useful. Like, we have that ability to always pause for a sec, and change direction. And particularly in the case of small business, where there's always something to plan for tomorrow, and there's almost always something we wish had gone better yesterday.
We really have to ask some calm questions about, Well, that thing yesterday. What lesson have I learned? Well, I've learned this lesson. I should try and stay calmer in meetings, because if I stay calm, the person I'm talking to stays calmer. What have I learnt about planning for tomorrow? Well, if I plan early and I keep a list and I check it all off, then I'm ready.
And I can revisit every day for a few minutes to make sure I'm ready, but thinking about it for three hours isn't going to make me more ready. I'm probably then not going to do something for the day after tomorrow. Or I'm not going to be present for today, for interacting with people, for having good ideas, for doing things properly.
So knowing that you have the ability to not get lost in yesterday and not get lost in tomorrow is very important both for mindfulness and mental health, but also for being able to do the best job you can do of being a small business person.
[00:11:53] Steve Davis: Yeah, and it's, it's interesting. This is, we're talking about this, we're talking about it for ourselves.
We're not just talking about it for you, dear listener. This is all an ongoing journey for all of us. It's a, it's a constant, um, thing to be aware of. And, I think the key thing for me that I get out of this, that Sam eloquently puts as well, is about, um, not just losing yourself to being identified with the thought.
Losing yourself in that, like sinking into quicksand. And it reminds me of another Leonard Cohen quote that I think is interesting. It's all about perspective. He says, We are so small between the stars, so large against the sky. And it just depends on where you're looking from, and I found that, uh, in the sweeping emotion of the lead up to the next presidential election in the U.
S., I got drawn back into Twitter. Also known as X. I still call it Twitter because I want to. Uh, if it annoys Elon Musk, it makes me happy. Um, and I found I was becoming intoxicated by drinking from that well. And in fact, I reckon we should just pick this up in just a moment, David, in the principles segment because there's a few key points that stretch on from this.
[00:13:14] Caitlin Davis: Our four Ps. Number two, principles. You can never be overdressed or over educated. Oscar Wilde.
[00:13:28] Steve Davis: There was a bleakness earlier this year on behalf of the world after Joe Biden really failed in a public debate against Donald Trump. I think everyone saw he was impotent. And then we, uh, from a, an oratory perspective, and you thought, oh no, the baton is going to pass back to Donald Trump. Uh, a man who's got a, I think it's fair to say, a track record of standing for nothing other than himself.
Um, just rambling. Just rambling, lies, saying whatever he thinks, whatever comes to his head, it's really bizarre to look back at some of the stuff he has said. But there's enough there that whips his people into a frenzy to maintain his momentum. And then you had the Democratic Party going, oh no, no, Joe's good, Joe's great.
And it took them, I think it was three to four weeks, could have even been five weeks after that debacle, before Joe stood down and Kamala Harris was, uh, suggested as, put forward as the, the candidate. I must say, as someone watching from the other side of the world, there was a sense of relief that at least now, especially with the early euphoria around her campaign.
That we're going to have at least a competition, and not just a lay down Mazere in that election. And then hopefully someone who's not perfect, but who understands the value of institutions, and our society relies on institutions functioning well, is going to have a darn good chance of winning. And I just found I was Wanting to have a quick look at the wonderful stream of great creative content, uh, that was, that is being created, uh, by this contest.
And then I'd look up and say there was 34, 30 minutes, 40 minutes just gone into the ether. And so I had to do what Sam Harris did and just turn it off, deleted it from my phone. Sometimes, David, you've just got to rip things out, don't you?
[00:15:26] David Olney: At a certain point. If something is taking so much time away, and is only appealing because it's giving you that big dose of emotion and dopamine.
So I give it emotion and dopamine, that leads to what? It was made easy for me, the walking away from Twitter, because when Elon Musk took over, he had no commitment to accessibility, and the app just became terrible overnight. It made it very easy to stop using it because it didn't work. I will forever be grateful that he doesn't care about accessibility.
[00:15:57] Steve Davis: Yeah,
[00:15:59] David Olney: yes.
[00:16:00] Steve Davis: So, so just on that, I think if we go to the content that was drawing me, it was watching the two different styles of Leda and, Why they were whipping up such frenzy, and we were talking the other day, David, you had some thoughts on this, that you were deriving and tying together from the Founders Dilemma, which we talked about previously on this podcast, but something that Kamala Harris was modeling that you were picking up on.
[00:16:28] David Olney: Yeah, what I found very interesting was that As much as we need amazing people to lead, or let's not say amazing, let's say spectacular in the case of Trump, because he's a spectacle. And Kamala Harris may not even be amazing or spectacular. She might just be credible. But most of us aren't sure we want to lead.
But most of us are pretty comfortable to follow a leader who values us, gives us autonomy, but gives us direction and support. And, you know, Steve and I were talking about this and then, then sort of brought it back into the world of small business. And, it's a really hard thing for founders of small businesses.
They can want everything done their way because, For a long time, they did everything. But if you want everything done your way, then you never get the best out of the people who work for you. You never behave like a proper leader who treats them like a talented follower. And what's really interesting with the pairing of Kamala Harris and Tim Walz, is even before Tim Walz was selected as Vice President, he'd made it very clear, I don't want to be President.
[00:17:48] Tim Walz: History will write the story. I keep hearing about this, what's this going to mean? Well we'll find out. We're pretty sure it's going to mean a fairer, more inclusive, better and more prosperous Minnesota.
[00:18:03] David Olney: You know, he'd made the point in multiple interviews. I'm a high school teacher and a football coach. I'm a sergeant from the National Guard. I love helping good things to happen. I love empowering people. I love helping bring people's vision or dream to life. I'm really good at that, but I want to be the person that makes, you know, the dream come true or the good outcome happen.
I don't want to have to define the dream necessarily. And I really like his honesty about being honest. a really good follower. And how important this is in small business. If you're a founder and you can open your heart and mind to the idea of finding good people and trusting them to get the job done, but do it in their way, you get all the benefits of the job being done well, and people taking immense pride in their day, and feeling that you empowered them and trusted them and supported them.
So they grow. Your company does well. You're less stressed because you don't have to do everything. The win for a founder of recognizing it's better to work with good followers than to try and build mini me's.
[00:19:17] Steve Davis: I got the impression, just to bring that again, to keep it in the realm of business, small business, that the job of the leader is you're on this sort of, you're trying to make your way through the jungle, and then you uncover a bridge that would be really handy, but can you picture it being completely overgrown with weeds and briar, and your job, apart from selecting the bridge as something we want to cross, is to get out the size and hack some of those weeds out the way, or as much of them, so your people then have freedom.
to get over in whatever way they can, uh, engender to make happen. If you can clear the pathway and give some direction and let the Tim Walls behind you then marshal his forces and troop, I think we're onto something.
[00:20:09] David Olney: Yeah, and the transition here to kind of Tim Walls experience as a National Guard provides another way to understand this from a business founders perspective.
You know, the military, you know, regularly The idea of mission orders is discussed, and that is, you don't tell a person what to do, you tell a person what outcome you want to achieve. And then you ask them, does that make sense? Do you have the resources to achieve it? Do you believe you can get that done?
And if they say yes to all three of those questions, you leave them alone. You check in occasionally. You're still good? Yeah, I'm still good. And when they come to you and go, Hey, I'm now not good. I need more resources. Or, we've actually discovered the bridge is in really poor conditions and you need to come and tell me if we fix the bridge because that's going to take time and resources.
So it's not that you surrender responsibility, but you trust people to get on with the job you've given them. And you haven't told them how to do it. You've said, can you achieve this for me? And the power of mission orders is incredible. Could
[00:21:14] Steve Davis: you imagine if we then apply this to Trump and Vance, which is his Vice presidential running mate.
Can you see them having that mature grown up conversation? I would expect that if JD Vance came back and said, oh the bridge is in disrepair, whatever, Trump would just hang him off the edge and chuck him over the side and say it's your fault, Buster.
[00:21:37] David Olney: Yeah, and the irony of this is with JD Vance's time in the Marine Corps, he understands mission orders.
And he would go back to Trump, I think, and say, Hey boss, the bridge is a disaster. We really need to decide if we put resources in or if we find another way. And he would expect from his experience for Trump to be sensible. And then probably wonder what the heck happened when instead he gets a tantrum.
[00:22:06] Steve Davis: Wow. And look, the other thing that I've experienced personally is obviously running. Talked about marketing and responsible for all those things. Uh, I am doing something else at the moment with some of my standup comedy. I've developed a new character, uh, who shall be revealed later, but he's basically a, um, a traveling, wandering Australian, uh, country singer, songwriter.
And with a workshop course I'm doing with about 12 other people, and Rick Price, who had a number of big hits in the 90s that you will probably remember for songs like Heaven Knows, we all had a collaborative songwriting workshop, and suddenly, after someone who sort of sits to have to make the decisions to be in, I guess, in charge of everything, I was one of four people.
We were sent off into a special room, To write a song together, and not one of us was the leader, we had to work collaboratively, and so I, I threw some offerings on the table, had other people then put some music to it, and other people suggest some extra lyrics, and it was quite a liberating experience to watch with everyone Wanting to collaborate, but at the same time willing to put their feet in the ground when there was something they deemed was important.
It was one of the most beautiful and empowering experiences ever. Is this possible in day to day business? I would like to think it is.
[00:23:40] David Olney: I would say it's absolutely possible because, you know, Rick had essentially set you all up to believe. that you can work together to get a good outcome. He had primed the ground.
And everyone there wants to write their own song, and everyone wants the experience of doing this. But he's kind of taught you the most important thing in music. You know, a band is not one person. A songwriter might get most of the song, but normally someone else helps them get the music the way they want it.
Someone else has a great idea for the chorus. Someone else has a great idea for the bridge. It's normally that music is better when it's collaborative, particularly in the popular music sense. A bit different if you're imagining, you know, an orchestral piece for 90 instruments. There it's about capturing the vision in your head first and then getting feedback.
But when it's going to be a singer songwriter and maybe three or four instruments maximum, their collaboration is actually what makes it beautiful.
[00:24:41] Steve Davis: Yeah, it was. And, of course, a band, you're banding together. Music is notes. You can play the perfect notes, but if they're not in the right order, the right timing with the others, it's discordant.
And I think there's something in that. Maybe next time we listen to any song, any piece of music we love, reflect on that as a model of us, and how we're a band. Modeling and structuring our daily life in Brazil.
[00:25:13] Caitlin Davis: Our four Ps. Number three, Problems. I ask the question for the best reason possible. Simple curiosity. Oscar Wilde.
[00:25:27] Steve Davis: In the problems segment this week, I want to dip into the well again of Alan Dibb. And his book, Lean Marketing, there was just something that we get often of people who have crafted some messages and they haven't quite worked. And so, if we look at one of the tenets of marketing that he talks about, crafting your message.
He's really clear on the classic insight. You've got to create a compelling message by making sure it resonates with who the heck you're writing to. And one of the big points he makes, which I concur with, is he's got a little checklist he runs. And the first thing is, Is it for them? Is it about them? And so many problems in communication happen because we can't get out of our own way.
Would you, would that be fair, David?
[00:26:22] David Olney: Oh, absolutely. Some of the best, worst material I've read In the world of communications is the stuff that someone loves because they've written it for themselves, but they've thought they've written it for their client. And when I've asked them, so your perfect client is you?
Yes? They're normally not very happy.
[00:26:42] Steve Davis: Well, even you and I were in the car coming over here today and we had a phone call from a gentleman who's a driving instructor who wants some help with some marketing. And one of the things he said was, I want help, I want to get some, you know, some Facebook advertising going.
I want it to be different. And I was quite relieved about that. Because you don't want to just turn out the same old, same old. The challenge is, yeah, difference is great, but it's still got to be different. Yeah. In a way that resonates with the people that you're after and just one of the things to tie this up you know in a bow from the active Proactive practical segment that the problem segment is is he said making sure his a few things on and said The message that you craft messages should be direct Relatable and include a clear call to action, so that we get it, we understand it, it makes sense to us, and now we know what to do next.
Part of that is avoiding generic messaging, all that stuff, to whom it may concern, and blah, blah, blah, all that spongy wording that just fills up space. Uh, we need a strong message, cuts through the noise, captures attention, because, The right message done this way, uh, can transform interest into attention and certainly as the driving instructor was right to ask for, having that point of difference, that novelty, gives us a little dopamine hit as a reader at the other end and who doesn't respond nicely when they've got a bit of dopamine flowing through their veins.
[00:28:21] Caitlin Davis: Our four Ps, number four, Perspicacity. The one duty we owe to history is to rewrite it. Oscar Wilde.
[00:28:36] Steve Davis: Earlier in this episode, we did talk a little bit about elections, uh, particularly in relation to the U. S., and so in perspicacity, when we look at old things and see if they would still relate today, I think it's only timely that we look at some of the great, already one of the greatest election advertising jingles of all time in Australian history, and it It's time.
The great campaign song that helped Gough Whitlam, uh, come to power. Now, let's have a listen to it, refresh our memories.
[00:29:15] It's Time: I'm a movie. Yes, it's time. Yes, it's time. I'm a movie. I'm the creator. I'm the movie. It's time to begin. Yes, it's time. Authorised
[00:31:15] Steve Davis: M. Young, Ainslie Avenue, Canberra, for the Australian Labour Party.
This This ad came about after 27 years of conservative rule, and I guess there is a point where you just, it's almost like we probably didn't even need this song, the change might have happened anyway, but there's something about this song, the message, the stirring up of that emotional spirit, uh, to give it some direction, some outlet, and it's time, uh, certainly captured the, the spirit.
of that particular point. Here's the question though. David, could Kamala Harris use this song?
[00:31:59] David Olney: I would want to remix it to sound less overtly 70s. Yes. But it's one of these really powerful ideas. It's time, but even if you listen closely to the words or not, it still doesn't lay out an absolutely clear policy platform.
What it's suggesting is it's time to do something Significantly different and I think that is an incredibly powerful, you know, message to send out. So if we really look at Trump's message of make it great again, MAGA, what does it say? What does it mean? Nothing. It means whatever you want it to mean. It's time is very much the same.
It's just that it's time for us has a connection with a government that tried to transform Australia, tried to transform Australia in a very progressive and inclusive way. It's the beginning of multiculturalism. It's the beginning of lots of things that define modern Australia. Um, And if you can use a message that is so simple that you can, you can front load with whatever meaning you need at the moment, that's a very good message because you can keep reusing it.
[00:33:17] Steve Davis: If you imagine, I don't know, going past someone and hurling comments out of the window to get them stirred up. It's like it goes past and it gets the emotional parts of us stirred up. Uh, it's obviously pointing them in a certain direction. And in many ways it's job done. It doesn't really matter why, but it is, it's, it's creating, it's taking something that's sort of Had probably congealed into stasis and actually putting some energy back into the system again and saying, you know what?
Yeah, it is time. It was something to latch onto, get a little bit of momentum going.
[00:33:58] David Olney: And you can really imagine sort of imagery going with it if it was reused of Someone's listening to it in a car and drives by, and someone gets up from finishing their coffee in a cafe and walks in the same direction of, Oh, at the end of the street it looks like there's a crowd.
What's that crowd doing? You walk down and you get involved. It really is, it seems to be implying. No, no, you have to do something too. Whereas if we take the contrast of Make America Great, the last word, again, it's going backwards. It doesn't imagine anything new.
[00:34:28] Steve Davis: Mmm. And whereas Kamala Harris's, her, her thing is never again.
Yes. Uh, which is cutting off the past, we're moving forward. Yep. Uh, the other thing I, I noticed, another parallel is, Kamala Harris has just about every celebrity under the sun on her side. Um, I did see something for the Trump campaign. They had some singer, and they had to have the well known singer, XYZ, and no one's heard of him.
Um, and yet, even, it's time. There was a massed sort of choir of people singing. Jack Thompson was there. There were other actors as well. It was like, most people in the creative arts, many of them have a progressive slant, but they don't put their hands up to get overtly political in
[00:35:13] David Olney: case
[00:35:15] Steve Davis: it hurts their career.
But there was something about its time that made them say, you know what, enough is enough. And of course, we, so that, that was, so in perspicacious terms, we're saying it's timeless. It could be used again, just update the music. And it's an evergreen. One quick thing, we can't talk about famous Australian election phraseology without the 1993 slogan, Keep the bastards honest, which the Australian Democrats used.
I mean, don ship. Gutturally, you know, guffawing that out just works pretty well, but it got a little bit diluted as every subsequent leader tried to say it.
[00:35:59] David Olney: It didn't sound quite the same from Natasha Stott Despoja, and Meg Lees, and Cheryl Curnow. They could say it, but they couldn't say it with The
[00:36:12] It's Time: vehemence
[00:36:12] David Olney: that Don Chip said it with.
Yeah, that backyard brawler sort of character. It worked in that voice. It didn't work coming from incredibly intelligent, very pleasant sounding people. Yes, no offence Don Chip, if you're still with us. He may be pleasant, but in that ad
[00:36:29] Steve Davis: he was more than pleasant. So anyway, there we go. Per Spicacilli, It's Time.
Yes, that time is evergreen. However, our time has run out. Thank you so much for listening to this episode. We'll be back in a couple of weeks with another one. And all that's left for me to say, really, is vote one. Davis Olney. Dictators of the
[00:36:48] David Olney: universe. Or would it be Olney Davis? I don't mind second billing as long as I'm the defense minister.
[00:36:55] Caitlin Davis: Thank you for listening to Talking About Marketing. If you enjoyed it, a thumbs up. Please leave a rating or a review in your favorite podcast app. And if you found it helpful, please share it with others. Steve and David always welcome your comments and questions, so send them to podcast at talkedaboutmarketing.
com. And finally, the last word to Oscar Wilde. There's only one thing worse than being talked about, and that's not being talked about.